The Holy Spirit, Suffering, and the Prayers We Cannot Pray | The Branch

Some seasons leave us without words. We sit down to pray and nothing comes out, or we repeat the same prayer again and again. In this episode of The Branch podcast, Pastor Chris Reed and Pastor Matthew Johnson revisit Sunday's message from Romans 8. They talk about suffering, God's plan for our lives, and the Holy Spirit who prays for us when we don't know how.

Pastor Chris sets up the conversation by describing the tension believers live in. God's plan is to make us whole. Pastor Chris points to the Hebrew word shalom to describe that wholeness. Yet right now we still live in a world where that is not our full reality. In those moments, we need the Spirit to pray for us.

Pastor Matthew shares a few seasons from his own life. As a high school student, he did not understand the grace of God. At church camp he felt God drawing him and softening his heart. At the same time he carried deep guilt and shame. He did not know what to pray, yet he still felt connected to God. He did not have the words then to explain that the Spirit was praying for him.

He also describes seasons in life and ministry when things did not go the way he expected. He started with the prayers he knew to pray, including prayers of repentance. He asked God if he was the reason things were not working out. When those prayers ran out, he did not feel the need to repeat them. Jesus is clear that we are not heard because of our many words. So Pastor Matthew simply told God that He had searched his heart and knew his desire to honor Him and lead well. Then he asked God to sustain him. He shares that this has happened even in the past year.

Pastor Chris asks if praying in tongues connects to this idea. Pastor Matthew says he sees them as connected. He did not mention tongues on Sunday because he does not believe tongues are the only way the Spirit prays for us. He also did not want to add to the confusion that ties being filled with the Spirit only to speaking in tongues. Still, he believes that when Paul talks about praying in the Spirit in 1 Corinthians, he is talking about tongues.

Every Saturday, Pastor Matthew prays over the auditorium in Lancaster, and Zach does the same in Logan. He walks through the room and touches each seat. He prays for the marriages in crisis, the people who have suffered loss, the sick, and those fading in their faith. When he runs out of English words, he turns to praying in tongues.

Pastor Chris shares that tongues help him when he feels like he keeps repeating himself or when his thoughts will not come together. It helps him connect to God without feeling like he has to perform. Before he speaks to the church, he often prays in tongues and asks God to use his mouth.

Pastor Matthew encourages listeners not to treat tongues as a last resort. He sees it as part of the generosity of God. When we run out of our own ability, God fills the gaps. He describes Paul praying with his mind while praying in tongues, thinking about a situation while trusting the Spirit to engage it.

"If it matters to me it matters to God. There's nothing too big. There's nothing too small. There's nothing that's off-putting." – Pastor Matthew Johnson

For those who have not experienced tongues, Pastor Matthew says it is okay to sit quietly and say, "Holy Spirit, pray for me." We can take deep breaths, relax, and trust His perfect prayers.

Pastor Matthew shares that Romans 8 felt fresh to him while he studied for Sunday. He noticed how much of the chapter focuses on suffering, creation groaning, and the Spirit meeting us there. He asks Pastor Chris why it matters that Paul admits we suffer.

Pastor Chris answers simply. It is the reality we live in. If Paul said Christians should float above all pain, it would not match our experience. Instead, Paul normalizes what we already face. Jesus stepped into our suffering and endured it Himself. Pastor Chris adds that the churches Paul wrote to often faced persecution. Following Jesus can cost us, and preparing people for that is the loving thing to do.

Pastor Matthew agrees. Without that honesty, he says, people tend to become either jaded or fake. Some decide God's promises do not matter because life is hard. Others feel they must wear a happy face to be good Christians. Paul's words give us permission to be real. Pastor Matthew points to Paul's thorn in the flesh and his long list of hardships. Because Paul was honest about his pain, his words about faith carry more weight.

Pastor Chris notes that Paul widens the view to all of creation. Pastor Matthew explains that he sees this as figurative language. Paul is showing that everything in our world is broken in some way. We see it in natural disasters, in sickness and death, and even in the trees that fall on his property each year.

Pastor Matthew says this helps us understand how great our hope is. When God restores us, He will restore everything around us too. There will be no sin, no sickness, no stress, and no relational tension. That is a glimpse of the new heaven and new earth.

Pastor Chris adds that the end of Romans 8 points to God making us more like Christ. Earlier in Romans, Paul compares Adam and Jesus. Pastor Chris says the thing we long for is the thing we were always meant to be.

Pastor Matthew notes that Paul ends Romans 8 by saying nothing can separate us from God's love. Pain often makes us feel the opposite. He asks Pastor Chris if he has ever been in so much pain that he did not know how to relate to God.

Pastor Chris shares that his hardest seasons come when God seems quiet. He starts to believe he has done something wrong and pushed God away. Something as small as not wanting to do his devotion one morning can send him into that cycle.

"When I walk outside in the morning I know my car is still there cuz I haven't got in and I drove away but it's foggy so I can't see it." – Pastor Chris Reed

His way through the fog is bringing other people in. He meets weekly with Pastor Brandon, who helps him see what he cannot see. Others remind him of God's promises in Romans 8 and pray for him.

Pastor Matthew loves the analogy. We can know God is good and loves us, yet pain clouds that truth. He values people who have come through the fog and can describe what they see. He also reminds listeners that fog lifts as the sun comes up. Over 47 years of walking in faith, he has moved from fear and hopelessness toward trust that God will carry him through.

Pastor Chris admits that trusting God when he cannot feel Him is still hard. Pastor Matthew shares that some seasons call for leaning on what we know and others call for being stirred emotionally, often in worship. He says we navigate this relationally with the Holy Spirit. We can tell Him, "I don't feel it. Help me feel it."

He also encourages Pastor Chris that God uses our struggles to reach people. Paul prayed three times for his thorn to be removed. God said no, and generations have found their story in Paul's words.

Pastor Chris asks how to share God's promises without turning them into easy phrases. Pastor Matthew recalls first hearing Pastor Chris say that Romans 8:28 does not mean everything is good. It means all things work toward good. Pastor Chris laughs and credits Tim Keller for the idea.

Pastor Matthew says the worst thing we can do is tell someone that something bad is not bad. Even the crucifixion was a real injustice. When someone is hurting, the loving response is to meet them in the pain without minimizing it. Then we can gently point them toward redemption.

"What God's promise was is not that we would be pain-free, but that in our pain he would be present and that in our pain there would be a purpose." – Pastor Matthew Johnson

That purpose may be for us, or it may be through us for someone else. Pastor Chris adds that God is more powerful and more lasting than our pain. Paul calls his troubles light and momentary because he knows how great the glory will be.

Pastor Matthew points to Psalm 139, where the psalmist says God has searched him and knows him. He asks what it means that the Spirit knows exactly where we are.

Pastor Chris shares a phrase from his counseling intensives this summer. God often saves us from ourselves. We may want a certain role at work and not get it. Later we may see that God kept it from us because it would not bring us life. Pastor Chris also says one wrong choice does not derail God's plan. God is shaping us to become more like Christ.

Pastor Matthew adds that a loving God sometimes has to say no. He compares God to a GPS that reroutes us after a wrong turn. In his devotions in Isaiah, he sees God warning His people while also offering a better path if they repent. Pastor Chris notes that the exile was a correction, not a condemnation. Both agree we still have to be willing to follow the new route.

Pastor Matthew offers a few layers of help. First, spend time in the presence of God through honest prayer. Journaling can help if prayer feels like a wish list. Be real and raw with God. Even Jeremiah told God how he truly felt.

"God has already searched your heart and knows your heart. So nothing you're going to say is going to offend God." – Pastor Matthew Johnson

He also encourages getting quiet and listening, because good communication is both speaking and listening. Jesus taught His disciples to pray in a private place. Finally, bring in mature believers who can speak truth through the fog.

Pastor Chris adds that he fills his time with sermons, worship music, and good books. He encourages people who struggle to pray to let the Psalms guide their prayers.

Pastor Matthew asks how trusting God differs from resigning ourselves to whatever happens. Scripture shows times when God calls His people to rise up and times when He says, "Be still and know that I am God."

Pastor Chris wants to redeem the word resignation. He sees obedience as resigning our own will. Sometimes that means going when we would rather not. Sometimes it means waiting when we want to act. The key is discerning what the Spirit is doing.

Pastor Matthew connects this to his message on nudges and checks. He believes we can tell the difference between our own insecurity and a real check from the Holy Spirit. Each situation is unique, so staying connected to the Spirit matters. Pastor Chris agrees and says we need to slow down and give God time to speak.

The conversation closes with thanks and a reminder that one more week remains in the series on the Holy Spirit, the person of God we need every single day.